|
Post by Chris C Crane on Aug 22, 2007 22:05:26 GMT -5
Chris, The two lines that I fish on the single handed rods are Rio's atlantic salmon and steelhead taper which is a longer belly line. The belly of the line is 33 feet and the overall length of the line is 110ft and has a gradual taper, I can dead drift or swing flies and it seems to handle sink tips pretty well. The whole head length of the line is 66 ft. So if you find yourself fishing larger type rivers with the single hander this is a great line. The other line that I fish is Rio's clouser line which is has a shorter belly I think the overall belly is 28 ft. I like this line the most for swinging flies because it has a more aggressive taper to it so it really turns flies over really well, the overall head length of the head is 40 ft so if you fish medium size to small streams this is a great line for doing that. It also can double as a bass and pike line, because it has that more agressive head to turn over big wind resistant flies. Hope this helps. If you need prices at all give us a call. Thanks, I think I'll need to make a mid-week border crossing for some line and a NYSDEC license renewal. Cheers,
|
|
|
Post by aelian on Aug 22, 2007 23:11:11 GMT -5
The T&T 1107 uses the same line as the 1307? The Scott 1088 with 10 wt line? That's just funny. No wonder they feel like broomsticks.
I'd love to show y'all how I rig and cast the Winston but I'll probably be fishing. I really don't care that much either.
American flies (mostly) and Korean rods. Now that's a winning combination.
|
|
|
Post by Nick Pionessa on Aug 23, 2007 5:52:49 GMT -5
Tom- if you consult Rio's chart you will see this, the 1107 and 1307 are both 7 weight spey rods. why would that be funny?. i guessing you didn't know but there are different grain weights for single handed and double handed rods. if spey casting you will need more grains in general but spey rods and single hand rods are not the same 7 weight. the Scott 1088 takes about 400-450 grains to load and the 10 wt outbound is 425 gr. since you clearly don't care that much i won't go into the real math involved but don't take my word for it look it up you might learn something.
are you sure you won't grace us with your presence and do a demo? i'm sure we could all learn a lot from someone with your casting prowess. we cast Sat eve and with the high temps today through sat and the extremely low water i would not recommend fishing the evening anyway. maybe you could stop by on your way home?
all our flies are American tied and i don't know what Korean stuff you are refering to, unless you mean TFO which are definitely made in Korea. i believe Echo is made in China. maybe you were just confused like with the rod weights. i know this is all complicated but try to keep up.
BR- Steve's right about the lack of inexpensive switch rods. Echo makes a 12' 6 weight as it's lightest rod in the traditional series and a 12' 4" 7 wt in the Echo 2 scandi rods, both are great for this area and reasonably priced. Echo's are $269 and Echo 2's are $349 and come with two tips. there is also nothing wrong with learning to spey cast with a single hander. it will work well for the smaller creeks and is a skill worth learning for all flyfishing situations. we will be casting saturdays through sept so stop by if you can.
CCC- the only line Steve missed is the delta sixth sense line from airflo which is an agressive line, not as long as the steelhead line but not as short as the clouser, another great choice for a little more middle of the road.
|
|
|
Post by ANDYCAMPING on Aug 23, 2007 19:15:41 GMT -5
Thanks for all the info guys. So have you guys picked up Echo as your entry level rods now? What happened to JP Ross? Falling out?
|
|
|
Post by Steve Dobmeier on Aug 23, 2007 19:58:09 GMT -5
J.P. Ross was a great rod company but it seemed that his company got to big for the demand. His rods were at a great price point for American made rods but could not keep up with the demand. His rods were great but the only ones that seemed to sell were the rod lines that were $100 to $200. None of his higher priced rods seem to fly (no pun intended). As far as I know he is no longer building rods but I could be mistaken. Echo rods offer a bunch of different models of rods and a very great price point with a lifetime warranty. The main reason was a Spey rod that was less than $500 dollars but that caould get the job done for the river that we fish. Also the fact that they are designed by Steve Rajeff, who is one of the best casters in the world and probably has some insight in how a rod should be built. The problem is that any American rod company that puts a rod out that is in the $150 to $200 ranger it is in big demand, these rod companies loose money building these rods and have to discontinue these lines. It is a simple supply and demand. I would love nothing more than to still have J.P. Ross rods in the shop but If customers are waiting on rods that are not delivered on time then that's just bad karma. There's is nothing that we could do about it. It sucks trust me we know but what do you do when backed into a corner.
|
|
|
Post by ANDYCAMPING on Aug 24, 2007 17:03:34 GMT -5
That stinks, but if you can't rely of service where are you. Oh, and I've been doing a bit of internet digging on the Echo rods and I belive its Tim Rajef not Steve though I do belive they're brothers. You guys still planning on casting tomorrow night? I'd like to stop by if the wife doesn't already have plans, Saturday nigh ya know. Any way, Lancaster (Cayuga Creek) right?
|
|
|
Post by Steve Dobmeier on Aug 24, 2007 21:46:29 GMT -5
Brookie,
You are right I tend to get the two confused, sorry about that. Yes they are borthers, I think that is why I tend to get them confused. Steve Rajeff is on the G-loomis pro staff and Tim is the one that is with Echo. Sorry about the mix up. I have a family party to attend and Nick has a wedding to attend as well so I think that tomorrow is out for the both of us. Next week we will be back on schedule. I have Friday free as well so if you want we can go there friday evening and cast for a few hours as well as Saturday. Let me know. Myself and a few others that were "stillgreen" to the spey casting world set out to the creek and casted for a few hours tonight. It was a good time and I think that everyone that was puzzled by spey casting got thier feet wet and learned what it was all about, so when they hear or see something about spey casting they have a better understanding. It always looks easier than it really is. I know that when I first started a few years ago I thought the same, until I tried it myself. There is a certain level of physics, timing, control, power, and finesse, and body motion that is involved, but if you break the entire cast/casts down in steps it becomes much easier to comprehend. I'm always up to go and cast for a few hours cause quite frankly it's just fun to throw that much line around, and you always tend to learn something new! Well it's martini time!
|
|
|
Post by aelian on Aug 25, 2007 19:52:34 GMT -5
According to Nick, T&T 1107 and Sage 1107 are "built as true two handers.. not switch rods like the winny." But then his findings confirm, "Winston 11' is basically a long single hander." Apparently the Scott too is designed as a two hand rod; it doesn't load well in smaller streams requiring casts <50' because it's too stiff. Who's confused?
The Winston BIIx will high-stick and cast/swing an unweighted fly >50' with a wf clouser line (for big nasties). Throw on a frankenstien line and your ready for the Catt. at 600+ or the upper and lower Niagara. A good switch rod will cast well either way, just don't expect it to act like a 15' 10wt. Sage and Meiser make nice rods as well.
Why are Rajeff & Hogan lauded as innovators doing their best to provide modestly-priced two-handers to the masses while Lefty Kreh (Korea?) is considered a shill? ECHO and Cabelas probably get their blanks/rods from the same Chinese manufacturer. Cabelas has two-hand rods for about 200 bones. Their customer service is solid and they are well established. A warranty is only as good as the company that prints it.
Switch rods are not a passing fancy. Like ccc, I select gear that fits the water I fish. From Webster to Westfeild, I haven't found a better rig.
|
|
|
Post by Nick Pionessa on Aug 26, 2007 11:03:07 GMT -5
i didn't mention the sage as anything i have never cast one. the T&T and Scott rods mentioned work very well in close with the proper line on them and they will also throw 100' if need be. they just require more grain weight to load them. why is that so hard for you to understand? this point alone tells me the winston doesn't have near the power of the Scott or T&T. if it loads with a line half the weight of the others it is half as powerfull. the bottom line is all we have heard is you talk about it no pics of fish taken waters fished you won't even show up and do a demo for us to prove it's and your prowess with sink tips and heavy flies. you may forget i fished one of those winstons for a month and drew those conclusions and went back to my T&T. this was a comparison of the the two rods and my conclusion. do a search on the spey pages and tell everyone there they are wrong too. i understand you wanting to plug winston, that's what you do, but try to have some truth involved or we just write you off as all talk and no action. have you ever cast a Scott 1088 or T&T 1107? that's what i thought. how do you know how they perform then? anytime you want to try them all side by side you just let me know. just plugging one rod while slamming the others without ever casting one is a poor critique at best. why are you calling Bernard Kreh a shill? he is one of the true gentlemen of this sport and i don't understand you calling him a shill. i don't believe switch rods are a passing fancy i just don't think the winston deserves that title as it doesn't spey cast well at all. a true switch rod must do both overhead and spey cast well and it simply doesn't. pick a rod for the waters you fish by all means just pick a good one after trying several and not blindly following what you were told. you would be pretty unhappy with that winston if you tried the others mentioned or the same configuration from beulah or meiser. the winston is the weakest of the bunch by many peoples account and if you never tried any of the others you would never no how mediocre it is. anyone other companies you want to plug while we are here? here's a pic of the Scott 1088 working a run with a skagit line, heavy poly leader and weighted tube fly. this cast is probably 35'. proof that these rods work well in close. any pics of the winston throwing a 12' 7 ips poly leader and weighted fly 75' (typical for the catt) or say a 10' hunk of t-14 and a big tube on the niagara? i'll wait...
|
|
|
Post by Chris C Crane on Aug 27, 2007 15:31:15 GMT -5
If your looking for a rod that will get the job done for under 300 you should take a look at the ECHO rods. These rods are designed by Steve Rajeff and Dec Hogan. These two gentlemen are probably the perfect crew to be designing a spey rod outside of Simon Gawesworth. They are made over seas but I think that there was a great deal of time an energy put in buy American spey fisherman in there design. Steve Rajeff is probably one of the best casters of single and double handed rods and would know better then anyone.......even Lefty Kreh how a spey rod should be built. Dec Hogan is one of the west coast's finest steelhead fisherman that you will find and knows how a spey rod should perform to get the job done. He was a guide on west coast rivers for more than ten years and probably knows what it takes to get the job done for his clients. I would bet that if you were given this rod without any markings on it what so ever you would fall in love with it. They make a ton of different models that can get the job done for you. If you are looking for American made Spey rods/Switch rods then you gotta lay the cash down for the product. I don't have any input on the Avid series spey rods. St. Croix's 13' 7/8 is still over $300 and you can get an Echo for under that price. We will have Echo rods to cast in a few weeks if you want to try them out. The more info you give us on what your looking for the more we can better put you into the rod that will satisfy your steelhead dreams. Pm me with more info and I will gladly do what I can to research something more to your liking. Steve Please update when you get the Echo rods in. Thanks, I don't believe there are any Eastern Canadian dealers for Echo. I'll add a new Echo rod to my NY shopping list.
|
|